Rhea Mann: The Asian Canadian and Asian migration studies program would like to acknowledge that this podcast was recorded on the traditional unceded ancestral homelands of the Musqueam Squamish and Tsleil-waututh First Nations. We hope that as we continue to facilitate these conversations about Asian diasporic communities, we also engage in critical dialog about what it means to be uninvited guests and settlers on these lands.
Hello and welcome back to the ACAM dialogs podcast. My name is Rhea, one half of the new team behind the podcast this year.
Nathan Ko: My name is Nathan, and we are both excited and honored to be a part of the ACAM team for our first episode. We want to share a bit about ourselves and where we would like to take the podcast.
Rhea Mann: So Nathan, how did you first get involved with ACAM?
Nathan Ko: Yeah, so I first got involved with ACAM through a friend Ashley. So one of my friends took an ACAM course, and they loved it. They were talking about it all the time, and talked about how, like, they were really able to connect with their Asian Canadian identity through these courses. And they knew I was passionate about it, so they really recommended me, like a bunch of different courses through the ACAM program. So I took them up on the offer, I did one ACAM course, my first one with Dr Laura Ishiguro. And that was amazing. Even though I was an online student, I still felt like I was in the classroom every single week. And I learned so much about the history of Asian Canadians, and really how we look at Asian Canadian history. So that was really inspiring to me. So I was like, wow, I really like this, and I’m really passionate about this topic. So I continued doing other ACAM courses. The next semester, I did ACAM 350 which was where we made, like a documentary, focusing on ACAM topic. And that was really fun to me, that allowed me to connect the creative side with this topic that I really enjoyed exploring and looking into a Canadian identity. So that’s kind of how I got involved with the department itself. And then a couple months later, Laura reached out to me because she saw a couple of videos that I made, and she asked if I wanted to be part of this team, because she knew I had multimedia skills. And, yeah, someone who’s again, really passionate about this topic and really passionate about telling stories through media, I think this opportunity was really cool to me, and I definitely saw that as a bridge between my identity and also my creative hobbies and outlet. So yeah, how about you? How did you get involved with ACAM?
Rhea Mann: Cool, so it’s actually really funny. I was also in Laura Ishiguro’s class last year. It’s a chem 300 so for those of you who don’t know, it is Asian Canadian history, and so I had the same kind of feeling about it, although I wasn’t recommended it because, specifically because of the Asian Canadian aspect, I just kind of typically take history classes. I’m currently in my fourth year, and I’ve taken one almost every year. I’m an English major, but poly minor, and I so history kind of fits in with that really well. So yeah, I took Laura’s class. I also thought it was really amazing to actually see Asian Canadians as an entire course, and not just like a unit in social studies, which is kind of like the experience in the Canadian public educational system. So yeah, I really enjoyed that. And that was actually the only class, a chem class, I had taken. And then over the summer, I was also kind of reach out about it, and so I’m super excited to be a part of this team as well the class itself and being on this podcast also connects some interests of mine as well, media storytelling, yeah. So that’s why it’s really exciting. And I think that pretty much wraps it up. Continuing with the theme of the podcast, Nathan, are the previous hosts I saw and Caitlin ask all their guests about their migration story. And so I will be asking you that, what is your migration story to Canada?
Nathan Ko: Yeah, I think this is a really interesting question, because it encapsulates not just my own life, but also the life of my ancestors, my parents, grandparents and so on. But yeah, like talking about my immediate family. My both my parents are Chinese, but they come from two very different backgrounds. So actually, my dad was born in Hong Kong, and for as long as they can trace back, his family had their roots in Hong Kong, they can’t really find where, let’s say if they came from China or whatnot, but it’s always been in the Hong Kong area. And my dad actually, after high school, he went to the US in the state of Wisconsin to go to college, and he eventually made his way up to Toronto. He went back to work in Hong Kong for a little bit, but then in. Immigrated to Vancouver in the late 80s. Yeah. So that’s my dad’s side. My mom’s side, like I said, is super different. Her family is actually long time immigrants, and they came, I think, around the late 1800s so my mom was actually a third generation Canadian, yeah. Like her grandparents came around when, like, Gold Rush was happening, around when new Asian immigrants were coming into Vancouver, and they actually owned like a grocery store, which is a really interesting, like, story of how early Asian Canadians kind of developed themselves in the community. But yeah, I remember my grandfather telling me stories of how when he was young, like Asians, in some ways, they tried to be like as Western as they could, and they tried to like, play down their culture as much as they could. And that was really interesting to me, because now when we look at it like, a lot of like Asian cultures celebrated in different aspects. And yeah, like for myself, I grew up predominantly in a white community, and I kind of saw myself from a young age trying to negotiate my asianness within it. Yeah, like as I grew up, I kind of started to have this kind of deep desire to connect with my culture and like its histories in order to understand, like, what it means to be both Asian and Canadian. Because I think I grew up just looking at myself as Canadian, but then I realized, oh, there’s such rich history through my family, through my culture, that I really want to explore. And that kind of leads me to where I am today, where I’m actively trying to seek that out, trying to learn more about what it means to be both Asian and Canadian in our society today. But yeah, how about you like, what is your migration story for yourself, and also like your family?
Rhea Mann: Yeah, so I also tell it from my mom’s side and my dad’s side as well. So my grandfather on my dad’s side, who I call Papaji, he came to Canada in 1971 oh, sorry, 72 I might as well get these right. He’s very he’s a stickler. He’s a stickler for facts. So I will correct that. 1972 and then a couple years later, my BBG, so my grandmother came with my dad and my Bhuaji, so my aunt, so my dad, his sister, and my grandmother, they came in 1976 and settled in the Vancouver area, and stayed there pretty much until I was born. So Vancouver was home for a while on my mom’s side. It is, it is a little, a little, a little bit of a longer story. My Naniji so my mom’s mother came to Canada in 1966 and lived in Duncan, BC, on Vancouver Island with her brothers. And so this is kind of a bit of a historical tidbit. Now, for those of you that don’t know, a lot of South Asian immigrants found work in the mill system in Vancouver Island, and so that is a part of my family history as well. My mother’s uncles were working in the mill system. And then my grandfather, my Nanaji, came to Canada to marry my Nani in 1968 so two years later, they got married in Paldi, which is a town near Duncan BC, and was the first kind of multicultural settlement in BC. It is like another kind of famous mill town. And so they didn’t live there, but it was the only place with a Sikh godwara, so where they could get married. So they got married in Paldi in 1968 and then were living in Duncan, then moved to Vancouver, to the main line, to the mainland, sorry, and then lived there for a couple years. My mom was born there as well as my uncle. So my mom was born in 1970 and my uncle was born in 1969 and then my grandfather, my Nanaji, was having a hard time finding work in Vancouver, and then he went back to the island because of the mill. So he worked in the portal Burney mill. I’m blanking on the name, but he worked in the mill for years, then after that, eventually becoming Foreman there. But yeah, so my mom mainly grew up in Port Alberni BC, and then years later, her and my dad got married in Vancouver, and my siblings and I grew up in Richmond. So yeah, lots of ties to the island and my mom’s like the small town girl, my dad’s the big city boy. But yeah, yeah. So that’s my migration story. I have a lot of nostalgic familial ties still on the island as well, but mostly I’ve, I’ve lived here in Richmond, so moving on. Oh, right, so we both have shared kind of our migration stories as well as our interests with ACAM. In general, and now we have both found ourselves in this space to host a podcast about all these things. And so Nathan, I want to ask you, where are your goals for this podcast? What would you like to do? Where do you see our hosting team going with this?
Nathan Ko: Yeah, for sure. I mentioned earlier how I’m really passionate about, like bridging media and Asian Canadian identity together. So I think that’s like the main goal. I really want to be able to tell stories that otherwise wouldn’t be told, or tell stories that, or be able to amplify stories that that we get to so lucky to have, like, a connection with in the ACAM community, and to be able to share that to the wider Vancouver or just community in general. I think that’s a big thing of mine. I also really like to explore different things like media and pop culture and how that ties into what it means to be Asian Canadian. Yeah, that’s like something that I really want to dive into through this podcast, whether that’s through film, music, or just art in general that we see in our day. Today, I’d love to just discuss about how that kind of relates to our asianness, our canadianness, and, yeah, how it bridges that gap. But that’s kind of my general understanding. Yeah, if you want to share about what your goals are, what your hope and vision is for this podcast as well,
Rhea Mann: Yeah, sure. So similar to you, Nathan, I also love pop culture. It is kind of one of my guilty pleasures, so I will likely enjoy bringing that up every episode that we record again and connecting that to what it means to be Asian Canadian. What kind of Asian Canadian media exists out there, and what does it mean? You know, questions of representation is something that I kind of find myself exploring on my own, and so this is a great platform to to speak on that I would also like to continue, kind of the momentum ice and Caitlin had with focusing on what’s happening at UBC with the a chem community speaking to faculty members, community members, about certain histories or topics that we may find interesting. I would also like to talk about current events and politics and things that are going on for Asian Canadians, because, you know, the world is a complicated place as we know it. There’s always things going on, yeah, and so these are all just facets that have shaped me as an Asian Canadian, and so I would love to delve into them, explore it further for our audience, and even just for ourselves, this is a great place to kind of challenge ourselves, maybe what we think it means to be Asian Canadian and kind of learn as we go as well. This is, this is not just a place for us to educate listeners. It’s also for us to learn. Yeah, yeah, which is what I’m excited about. As Nathan and I record this. It is now the first week of October, and personally, I finally feel like I’m coming back into my routine with school. I know where all my classes are. I know the fastest route to get to them, between all of that kind of stuff. And before we know it, midterm season will be coming up as well. But some of the things that helped me get back into my routine, as well as helpless threats, is watching movies and TV shows. And so that’s something that Nathan and I bonded about so we would like to start a segment on the show called the watch list, where we share, kind of our recent watches, things that are interesting. Ideally, they would also have an ACAM spin as well as maybe just general pop culture news that we like to share with you guys.
Nathan Ko: Yeah. I mean, I can’t really think of really succinct thoughts that I’ve had about different things, but I recently actually went to the Vancouver International Film Festival that’s going on right now, and I watched a movie called Fly me to the moon, and it was a Hong Kong movie that is about like a family of four, so parents with two kids, and the dad is actually like a drug addict. So it’s about like the daughters growing up, and it’s like a coming of age movie. So it was really interesting, because I think it painted Hong Kong people in a different light for me. So like I said, My family’s from Hong Kong, but what the movie highlighted was, like, there’s a scene where a movie where these high school kids, one of the daughters, is part of, like, this group, and their friends are kind of like looking down on people who are from the mainland and who aren’t, like, I guess, born in Hong Kong. So like, an interesting spin, an interesting perspective that I never really understood, being kind of in Canada as an outsider, feeling like an outsider looking into Hong Kong. I didn’t know there was a level of classism. I guess what it meant to be born in Hong Kong versus not born in Hong Kong. So I don’t know that was interesting. But also, just like the film in general, was a really cool film, yeah. Talking and highlighting about what it means to understand like who you are and understand and how that relates to like your family members, how to reconcile, obviously, deep hurt with this love that you have for a family. So it was like, I think it was a really interesting film. It was really sad, like the person beside me was just crying for like, oh my god, like, last couple minutes, yeah. But it was, like, a really good film, and it was really cool that this film was, like, shown in Vancouver, which is like, across the ocean from Hong Kong. So I think overall, yeah, it was just a solid film, and I would definitely recommend it fly me to the moon. It’s called, but yeah, I think that’s like something that I watched recently. If you have anything that you saw or read?
Rhea Mann: Yeah, well, like, I’ll touch on your movie first. That sounds really interesting. And I also think the kind of issues of drug related crisis is also relevant in Vancouver, as well, with the many issues and stuff we have regarding drug use in Vancouver. So that’s another level that I think is really cool, not cool necessarily, but interesting that it was being shown here. So if you had to read it out of five, five stars.
Nathan Ko: Oh, this is like a letter box review. I would say it’s like a 3.5. I’d say I’m a hard grader. So 3.5 is not bad. Like, a three is average, right? Yeah, around for me. So, like, it was really good, and I was really, I think, beautifully shot. But I think there’s aspects of the story that, like, could have been used better, but I know overall, like, it was a really touching film, the characters, the acting, I think, was really great, but yeah, like, I’d say 3.5 maybe 3.75
Rhea Mann: okay, oh, wow, yeah, yeah, okay, I will definitely check that out. I don’t really have any movies that I’ve seen recently, but I will share a little piece of pop culture news at the Juno Awards. So the Canadian their Canadian Music Awards, for those of you that don’t know, they recently announced a new category, and it is for South Asian music recording of the year. And so it’s essentially going to be a category specifically highlighting Canadian South Asian artists. And next year will be the first time it’s an official category, which is really interesting because the Junos are also going to be in Vancouver next year. And a lot of the South Asian artists that have been coming up, Carnage, LA and AP Dylan, they have been Vancouver or BC based. AP Dylan, kind of settling on the island. Carnage. La, being from here, BC, the Greater Vancouver area. Sorry. And so I just, I thought that’d be interesting to share with everyone. If you didn’t know, I think the South Asian artists in Canada have been kind of bringing a whole new level. It’s a great example of the diaspora and kind of fusion music as well. A lot of these artists are mixing in kind of rap and RB and B elements as well as collabing with other English speaking artists. So yeah, I thought that was kind of cool to share. I recommend looking into that further if you guys are interested. Yeah. Otherwise, for my watch list, I will need to be adding some more ACAM related things. I am currently in ACAM 250 and I may be re-watching past lives for that movie. Sorry, I may be re-watching past lives for that class. And, yeah, Celine Song writer, director is Canadian.
Nathan Ko: I didn’t know that. It’s like one of my favorite movies. I did not know that.
Rhea Mann: Yeah, amazing. It’s so good. I love it too. She’s Canadian, yeah. And it’s actually, like, we’re kind of, you know, segue here, but it’s actually based on her life, like, partially. Oh, so the situation, for those of you that don’t know Celine Song is the writer, director. I’m blanking on the main character’s name, but basically her childhood friend from Korea comes back into her life as an adult, and she’s married and living in New York City. And, yeah, this actually did happen to Celine Song, and it inspired the film, yeah. So, so, yeah. It does have that ACAM element. The character, also, they do show that she immigrates. Her family immigrates to Canada, so, but ultimately, the movie takes place in New York. Well, I’m excited to hear your thoughts about it next week. Yeah, yeah. I mean, I have seen it, but I will be re-watching it for one of my classes, and I’m very excited. It’s a great movie. I think I gave that movie five stars. I don’t remember, but yeah, that’s, that’s, I guess that’s on my watch list.
Nathan Ko: Okay, yeah, I’m excited to hear about that.
Rhea Mann: We would like to remind you all that the ACAM tributaries journal is out now. The tributaries journal, just like the podcast, is a product of the Asian Canadian and Asian migration studies program. Yeah.
Nathan Ko: It brings together different platforms, mediums and genres to explore the diversity of lived experiences, Migration Stories, identities and community connections.
Rhea Mann: You can read the fifth volume of tributaries now this year, the tributaries theme is how we can conceptualize Asian and Asian Canadian diaspora through a lens of continuity, exploring the past, present and future, making the larger tapestry of the Asian Canadian existence and presence. You can read all the lovely work submitted this year and celebrate 10 years of ACAM by heading over to tributaries, ACAM journal.wordpress.com, to read now.
Nathan Ko: Yeah, and that concludes our first episode with Rhea and I as host of the new ACAM dialogue podcast. We’re excited about the upcoming episodes, so stay tuned for more. Check us out on our ACAM social media and yeah, keep this conversation going. So we’ll see you guys next time. Bye.